Comparing the C18 and the present day should always be attempted warily. Such comparisons can, without meaning to, distort the past--unless we recognize that (a) our familiarity with the present will always make the present seem better (more natural and reasonable) and (b) there are so many differences between past and present that one can, without noticing, be comparing apples and oranges. Moreover, it's easy to get sidetracked. Talking about the present is so much easier than talking about the past that it can be hard to stay focused on the reason why you're making the comparison in the first place: to understand the past better.
THAT SAID, sometimes taking a minute to articulate and recognize present-day beliefs and assumptions can help to show how ideas in an older text are distinctive, interesting, counter-intuitive, or otherwise worth exploring further. It's sometimes easier to articulate what seems peculiar or worthy of mention in an older text if you can contrast it with ideas we take for granted.
So, how is the companionable suicide being offered in this song similar to or different from the suicide pact between Koharu and Jihei? How does the view of death or suicide offered in this song differ from the attitudes we encounter in The Love Suicides of Amijima? Both of these texts seek to make death seem like an attractive option--but do they do so in similar ways? What interesting differences do you perceive?
Deadline: Friday (2/11), start of class.
13 comments:
In The Love Suicides at Amijima and Death Cab For Cutie’s I Will Follow You Into The Dark, the similarities of the lovers’ suicides are that the women are both the first to die and the men follow. In both circumstances, they leave behind survivors especially Jihei’s family. Also, in the works, suicide is seen as the last resort to end the couples’ problems. They do not want to die, but it is their only solution to be together. Therefore, they make a suicide pact as a result of their intense feelings. Both texts glamourize suicide and make it look romantically appealing instead of focusing on its consequences.
In the song and story, similar phrases are used. A line in the song says, “If Heaven and Hell decide that they both are satisfied” and a line in the story says, “Take me with you to heaven or hell!”(page 66). Both acknowledge the possibilities for afterlife and are comfortable with the chance of residing in either location as long as they are together. Moreover, the song says, “It’s nothing to cry about ‘cause we’ll hold each other soon” and the story says, “Let there be no tears on your face when they find you” (page 67). They seem by ignore the sadness of the present but instead focus on their eternal future happiness.
One difference between the depictions of death in The Love Suicides at Amijima and the Death Cab for Cutie music video is how the central characters perceive death. In the music video, the representation of death as a hole that gets progressively wider suggests that the song's writer at first perceives death as something unknown. Conversely, in Love Suicides, Jihei and Koharu speak with confidence about their conception of the afterlife.
Koharu explains that death ends material existence, but souls remain "twined together" (66). Jihei agrees that souls are immortal, and death merely frees them from physical existence. Although Koharu expresses some trepidation about suicide, it is not for fear of death as an unknown state. Like Koharu and Jihei, the man in the music video embraces death but only once he has seen that the void created by the hole is not something to be feared.
I think one of the key differences between Jihei and Koharu's sense of death and Deathcab for Cutie's sense of death differs in that Jihei believes he knows what to expect in the afterlife, while Deathcab clearly states that the lovers are following each other "into the dark". I believe in this case that the darkness is the unknown, and that Deathcab is focusing on the idea that their love is strong enough to face the unknown. To Jihei and Koharu, they believe death is a reward, allowing them to be together in Heaven or Hell.
Also, Jihei and Koharu see death as their only escape, while Deathcab sees death as an eventuality not to be feared. They don't claim to want death in the song, they're just ready to embrace it when it comes.
I agree with both celeste and steve in a sense because both males in each instance is following the female into death. They both kind of pronounce that they will follow the other. One major difference is the sense of suicide and death, one instance seems more storyline and the other has a more dramatic view. I believe that both the Love Suicides of Amijima and Death cab for Cutie sees death as the only option, they are without the one that they want to be with and no one can replace them.
SteveL said it very well when he said that Deathcab for Cutie's sense of death is rather different that Koharu and Jihei's idea of what death will bring. Deathcab's idea of darkness points to the unknown that comes with death. This song is supposed to show that it doesn't matter what death will bring because as long as they're together, it's worth it. The point would be to show that love gives them strength to face whatever death brings.
I think the biggest difference between the two is the fact that "Love Suicides" involves a suicide pact between Jihei and Koharu. Deathcab for Cutie doesn't necessarily talk about suicide (at least on the part of the woman); they just simply say, "Love of mine some day you will die." This doesn't involve consenting to a suicide pact, but frankly saying that death is inevitable.
Death Cab for Cutie’s “I Will Follow You into the Dark” is about a lover's promise to follow the one he loves, even to death. The singer doesn't know what awaits his love when she passes - he even suggests the idea that neither Heaven nor Hell is a possible end. Yet, he chooses to remain by her side, even if that means going literally into a dark place - with no end in sight, full of uncertainty. This parallels Koharu’s and Jihei’s promise to commit suicide together. Koharu promises to follow Jihei into the death even though she is unsure what’s after death. However, I am not convinced that Koharu commits suicide for love.
In the second verse pertaining to Catholic school, where the singer makes known his dislike of his education there he states that he was taught that "fear is the heart of love", or that from fear comes love, and not agreeing, chooses to leave the school, and possibly the faith. I believe the verse is just another way to show the singer's idea of death includes neither Heaven nor Hell, and is to him, simply darkness. He then leaves the school because of this and in relating back to Jihei and Koharu, they both leave behind the social and cultural expectations of the Japanese culture to “be together” (If you believe that they did it out of love for one another).
I guess, in a way, you could say that this song's central theme isn't about death per se - rather it is the use of death to define life. The singer tells his lover he is willing to follow her to death, meaning he is willing to stay with her until then. He wants to grow old with her, and be by her side for as long as he can. He is willing to follow her into uncertainty, even if that uncertainty means death, or in this case, darkness. It's not uncommon to hear of old couples who have lived and loved together for many, many years to grow extremely close. Often, when one passes, the other soon follows, and this might be the message the song is trying to convey. It is similar with how the end of the play is portrayed; Jihei kills Koharu then kills himself. However, unlike in the music video, Jihei is sure about suicide. In the music video the main character circles around the hole and when he falls in he tries to climb out, so the main character is more representative of Koharu.
I tend to think that Death Cab has romanticized suicide to the point where it is no longer recognizable alongside the Love Suicides. Even if you just examine the portrayal, Death Cab sidesteps the whole "you have to kill yourself" part of suicide and looks at it as an existential decision, which they manifest as jumping (or falling, as it were) into a hole and descending into darkness. It's no less of an existential decision in The Love Suicides, but the graphic description of the how is so different. It's a more Realistic (capitalization purposeful) way of looking at the institution of suicide because it doesn't choose to ignore the process in favor of the goal of metaphysical joining of two lovers.
This same idea is evident in the wording of the titles. "The Love Suicides" versus "I will follow you into the dark". Once again, Death Cab (and we can generalize to all other "emo" bands as well) has found a way to look beyond the fact that there is a form to the function of dying, and concentrated only on the fact that the lovers can be together without the responsibilities of the rest of the world. "Love Suicides", by keeping the word "suicide" in there, keeps the proverbial knife in the picture.
In today's society, you might be able to go so far as to say that there are more reasons to feel as though suicide is a viable option. However, I think there's a fundamental difference between how the ancient Japanese viewed that institution rather than the modern West. The Japanese viewed it as a last resort as well, but it was still an option. The modern West won't talk about it, won't examine it, and refuses to believe that it happens. I think the disparity between the play and the song illustrate this.
In Death Cab, suicide is meant as a way to connect the two lovers together, just like in The Love Suicides of Amijima. One difference I did notice is that the person who is loved died first and it doesn't seem like they just died within the last few minutes. They died, probably from a natural cause. Even if they did die from a suicide, in this story it looks like she had a choice in what she wanted to do. That women had control of her decisions and people she loved up until the time she died. Going back to The Love Suicides of Amijima, Koharu did not have a choice over her live because of her social class. It was Jihei who held all control since the beginning, he did not have to drag Koharu down with him. He was selfish in what he did, just because society would look down on their relationship, he decided that they should make a love suicide. If Jihei had really wanted to, he could have said enough I love Koharu and want to be with her. Instead he chose to ruin two lives, by staying with Osan and causing Koharu to kill herself. In Death Cab on the other hand, suicide is seen as a more romantic gesture. Whoever he is talking about has died, and no one is forcing him to kill himself. No one is saying that it would be immoral to keep living without his lover. This guy wants to commit suicide because he wants to be with his lover in the afterlife. Granted Jihei also wishes to be with Koharu and because of society he thinks that the only way that this can happen is by being together when they are dead. Even though the two stories wish to accomplish the same thing, Jihei never really allows Koharu to pick his destiny. When Koharu tells the "samurai" that she wishes not to die, Jihei becomes mad at her and for what because she picked a very reasonable choice that many people might do. Jihei behaves like a little child who only wishes everyone to do what he wants to do. They both don't need to die to be together, instead he should man up. In Death Cab the only way that they can be together is in death, but that is because one is already dead. In Jihei's story, both are alive and don't need to die to be together, did just happens because Jihei is powerless. Rather than do something about it, he runs away. He gives up. He doesn't even care for his wife. In Japan one of the most important relations in confucianism is the relatino between husband and wife
I agree with those who point to a romanticized view of death itself in the Death Cab song, with its innocuous framing of it as "dark". Even though it is not Heaven or Hell, he still claims he can follow his love into this vague end, joining her much as Koharu wishes Jehei to come join her in Love Suicides. Though with similar ends expected, the two sets of lovers arrive at the facing such a decision in drastically different ways.
For Death Cab, the song is tantamount to a lullaby, both in its musical mellowness and that it makes a reassuring claim of following love to the end, a largely symbolic gesture reflected in many love songs. Instead of songs, we of course have suicides in the play, the pledge to be together proved with the lovers bringing about their own deaths, not even for the love itself but to save honor.
An interesting question for the song in gauging how closely it relates to the play is interpreting whether or not "follow you into the dark" implies him committing suicide to rejoin his lover, or merely assuring her that he will eventually be with her again. He promises he won't be far behind, but is he talking in the eternal terms of the dark, or the more temporal terms of our lives?
The Death Cab for Cutie version treats suicide as a possibility that he just happens to fall into, which in the video is represented as the black hole in the floor that grows larger and larger until the singer can’t help but fall into it. In The Love Suicides at Amijima, the suicide is an active, not passive, decision. Part of Jihei’s motive is pride – he doesn’t want Tahei to pay for Koharu’s marriage when Jihei has been her constant patron the past two years. In Death Cab’s song, he has no reason to survive – he lives alone in a tiny room. And he thinks he has experienced everything he needs to in life, singing, “You and me have seen everything to see / … /And the soles of your shoes are all worn down.” But in Love Suicides, Jihei still has his kids and his wife he could live with, provide for and create memories with. Even Koharu tells him “But you must be worried about your children” (67). Jihei cries throughout the play when he thinks of abandoning his children, but he never wavers in his decision. Lastly, both works refer to heaven and hell and the status of their souls. Koharu tells Jihei, “…but what does it matter as long as our souls are twined together? Take me with you to heaven or to hell!” (66). Death Cab’s refrain begins, “If heaven and hell decide / That they both are satisfied / Illuminate the no’s on their vacancy signs,” and ends with following “I’ll follow your soul into the dark.” Both songs are uninterested in whether they end in heaven or hell and only concerned with their souls lasting together. I think Death Cab presents suicide as a much more emotional, desperate, last-chance-for-love choice, whereas Love Suicides, although not uplifting, gives more material and superficial reasons (monetary and pride).
One of the differences that I noted between the song and literature is that the singer in the music video seems to not be eager to follow his lover into death. Throughout the music video, as the hole gets larger, the singer finds himself in a position where he falls into the hole, but he tries to get out of it, or try to save himself. That either represents his fear of staying true to his words or he is trying to find other means to get around the situation (he is seen making his way around the huge hole to get to his bed). The singer wants to follow his lover into the darkness, but he is still unsure about this decision.
In Love Suicides, Jihei is so certain about killing himself and Koharu, that he doesn't seem to hesitate for even a second. He is so desperate to end his life with his love, and he seeks out no other possible solutions to their situation.
Also, in the music video, I feel that the singer really has no one to leave behind if he died. His room shows his independence through its emptiness and his single bed. We are also shown that he spends pretty much most of his time there, sleeping, eating, doing his daily business. He appears to be lonely. And I feel that his main motive for considering to follow his lover into the dark is to accompany her because she is also lonely. I find this kind of motive to be a more noble and selfless reason to commit suicide.
In Lovers Suicide, both Jihei and Koharu leave behind family and their reason to commit suicide together doesn't seem really selfless at all. They're selfish and they only think of each other. They obviously don't seek out any other possibilities to be together.
Also, Jihei's and Koharu's suicide was definitely forced. It seemed to me that Koharu was more forced or persuaded to commit suicide other than entirely voluntary. In Death Cab for Cutie's song, nothing was forced. The singer knew that his love was going to die, and after much pondering, he then considers to follow her.
The similarties and differences between, "The Love Suicides at Amijima" and song by Death Cab for Cutie's "I Will follow you into the Dark" both are about suicides involving the love that each a man and a woman both seem to have for ach other. Hence, in the song as depicted by Rachel I recieved the same feeling that he didn't want to fall into the hole but did. He seemed that once he had fallen into the hole he was trying to find himself out. I kind of thought of this could have been symbolic to some signs of regret. In "The Love Suicides at Amijima" I got the idea that the woman "Koharu" was suppose to commit sucicide first then "Jehei" to follow behind.
However, I never heard this song before until now and my first reaction was that he seemed to be of course very sad & depressed about this person that he had love for and i got the idea that this was all caused by "love" not that he might actually commit suicide but was forced to because he seemed without this individual thats all was left. In the play, "The Love Suicides at Amiijima" I felt that they both actually had to commit suicide because that was the only place they could be together without the interruption of others.
These two companionable suicides are different because of the outlooks on death. In the music video, the characters see death as something they want to discover, as in they have no clue what it will be like. Koharu and Jihei seem to thing they know exactly what will happen and thats the reason they want to do it. This difference completely separates why the two similar cases aren't as similar as you would think.
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